Re-thinking Feminism

Posted on October 14, 2009 by elizabeth

IMG_3836
after the rain…Canon Digital Rebel, 50mm

Feminists get a bad rap in conservative Christian circles.

When I was a fundamentalist, I read anti-feminist books, discussed the "lies of feminism" and learned that Christian women had no business wearing miracle bras because…well, God cared about everything.

Including our underwear.

We also learned that feminists made bad wives and mothers. A Christian woman always deferred to men and never worked outside the home because that was her "God-given role."

Plus, men had delicate egos and if we opened a door for ourselves, spoke our minds or had a better education we were in danger of emasculating them and "usurping their God-given authority."

Men also had a very difficult time not looking at us. If a man looked at us, it was our fault for stumbling him. A truly godly woman wore baggy, long-sleeved turtleneck sweaters and ankle length skirts with boots and a full slip.

Even in the summer.

It was a lot of nonsense, really. And it stunk for men, too. Not all men have fragile, delicate egos. Some of them are quite capable and secure in their manhood. Some of them like a woman who speaks her mind, opens doors for herself, writes a blog and doesn't care much for cooking.

Not that I know anything about that!

I realize that a strong woman is intimidating to some men.

I just wish being strong wasn't confused with being shrill. And in my experience, that's what we fundamentalists believed: feminists were rebellious man-haters and shrews that must be tamed.

However, the problem was not with feminism per se, but with the fundamentalist tendency to see the world through a black-and-white lens.

In fundamentalism, everything is either good or bad. Sacred or profane. Spiritual or "worldly."

Mix in the added toxin of over-spiritualizing everything and pretty soon feminism isn't just suspicious–it's Satanic.

Now I'll readily admit that there are certain sectors of feminism that are extreme, even abhorrent. But all revolutionary social movements have their resident whack-a-loons and provocateurs.

Which is to say, the rhetoric can get crazy on either side of the aisle.

The fallacy lies in misapplying the principle of "a little leaven leavens the whole loaf." Or to put that in non-KJV vernacular: "a little poop ruins the entire brownie."

I guess I'm just wary of applying that principle to the entire idea of feminism.

The reason I call myself a feminist is because I believe women should have options.

To me, that's what feminism is. It's not about being pro-choice or brazenly breaking God's commandments. It's about having the ability to make a better life for myself and my family without being stigmatized for operating "outside my God-given role."

And if fundamentalists were honest with themselves, that's what they believe, too. The whole reason fundamentalist women are able to publish books and blogs about "Biblical patriarchy" in the first place is because feminists made it acceptable for women to speak out!

Frankly, I'm thankful for feminists.

Are you?

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  • Whitney

    Amen. Preach it, sister.

    I thank God for feminism. It allowed me to get an (excellent) education, to marry of my own accord, and to have an equal marriage (I do consider myself a complementarian, but it’s still an equal partnership).

    And every now and then, that little feminist inside of me can be pretty loud. :-p

  • http://www.emergingmummy.com Sarah@EmergingMummy

    This is brilliant and true. I loved every word of it.

  • http://becomingthekindofwomaniwantmydaughtertobe.wordpress.com Alisa

    “Or to put that in non-KJV vernacular: “a little poop ruins the entire brownie.”"

    Oh dear, you really got me laughing there!

    Great post. And yes, I’m SO grateful for feminists… especially the one named Jesus. ;^)

  • http://thejunia.blogspot.com/ junia

    Coming from a very liberal background, I can’t say that I would want to tout the label “feminist” nor be grateful for them. Perhaps I’d be thankful for what the original women’s lib movement stood for, but current feminism (I feel) goes beyond simply thinking that “women are people too” (as one friend would say). Being grateful for strong women is one thing, but grateful for feminism is totally another. If you look at feminism now, it’s really quite selfish, and I’d daresay it’s not exaggeration to say that feminists discard the complementarian view.

    I would not want to put Biblical, strong women who speak their minds in the same category as “feminists.”

  • http://veniteadoremus.wordpress.com/ Venite

    My mum was friends with staunch feminists, some of which dumped her when she got together with my dad, because she was “sleeping with the enemy”.

    …right.

    I’m grateful for feminism. But for some ladies it turned into “we HAVE to do all the things men do”. I don’t want to HAVE to do anything for any reason besides my own choice/family obligations, thank you very much!

    Oh, and they’d better remember half the fetuses are female.

  • Rachel Sheep.

    After believin all the feminist lies – and they are huge lies -, are women happier? After the 60s revolution to defend women´s “rights” (as if they had been denied by true Christianity), the truth is that our world isn´t better, families are ruined, children are abandoned by mothers who only think about themselves and have no respect for their husbands or the family as a whole, or anything that comes into their way, and women aren´t happier, but more frustrated, nervous and permanently angry to everybody. I don´t think feminism has done anything positive.
    Women, men and children are happier when everything is in its God-ordered place (I hope nobody mocks this sentence, because it´s the biblical truth even if many people don´t like it). Feminism enslaves us women, pushing us out of our homes to get a success that isn´t synonim of happiness. Feminism causes men to feel disoriented and confused, because it´s ofended by true gentlemen who play the role of a real Christian man – let´s not forget it was Victorian gentlemen who invented that famous statement: “Women and children first”, so maybe they were not such great oppresive male monsters.
    I recommend this website to all the recovering feminists and to everybody who has any doubts or lacks information about the real face of feminist movements:
    http://www.ladiesagainstfeminism.com

    It changed my life some years ago. I hope it may be useful to others too.

    Rachel.-

  • http://www.24andprolife.blogspot.com Jenelle

    I’m definitely grateful for options. I am glad I’m allowed to vote and have a political opinion. However, I don’t know what to say about the term feminism so I won’t get caught up on semantics. I do think that more emphasis needs to be put on the family and how women can feel like equals within the home. Getting rid of all family obligations because women want to go out and accomplish professional goals will not help the society. On the other hand, I have no problem with some women doing that and even dads staying at home if that is the situation that works best. I like options, but I don’t like to be told what option I need to choose which is what I think some “feminists” do.

  • Marie

    I graduated from a liberal college and took plenty of classes taught my feminists, so I learned a lot about it, while still keeping my Christianity. I try to stay away from the term “feminist”, I like to just think of it as women being free. However I dislike how some feminists take freedom as selfishness. I at one point thought I was a feminist, but the more I learned about God, the more free I felt. Way more than the “freedom” I felt with feminist thinking. I guess I don’t see myself inferior to men, so I don’t feel it’s my life goal to be equal to them, or go above them. My focus is on God and what HE wants me to do. As long as I get respect, which I know is to be earned, that’s all I ask for!
    Fighting for truth is always honorable, but some take it too far, turning it into a war.

  • GrammaMack

    “Frankly, I’m thankful for feminists. Are you?”

    You’ll have to specify which feminists in particular before I can answer that question. Some feminists are responsible for poisoning women with the lie that unborn babies are not fellow humans to be cherished but parasites to be disposed of if desired. Others contributed to marriage and monogamous marital sex losing their honoured status in the thinking of young women. Others degrade all men and poison young women’s thinking in that way. So which feminists in particular are you thankful for?

  • Rachel

    I think that you, Liz pointed out beautiful the fundamentalist extreme. I think your thinking is what led to the beginning of feminism. Women simply got sick of being marginalized and left without options. The right to own property, vote, etc. gave women the ability to control their destiny and, should they get into horribly abusive marriages, etc, to leave.

    In typical human form, there is another extreme, a feminist extreme. One that insists women don’t need anyone else, particularly men. The attitude that a woman can have it all, career, family, everything completely on her own. One that minimizes the father’s role in family life. An extreme that pushes women to quantity over quality. One with a double standard, that praises a woman who chooses a career instead of family but patronizes a woman who chooses family instead of a career as weak. A standard of the woman who can supernaturally balance family, work, social life, and do it all. The result is stressed, overburdened women who feel like failures if they don’t do it all.

    For me, the goal again is balance. I am not going to have my ideas or opinions dismissed because I have a different anatomy. I am going to be a partner in my marriage with a equally valuable voice. I am married to a man who loves to hear my ideas. However, I am also going to be free to choose what is important to me. To choose to focus on one career (mom, is my right. It requires a level of trust in my relationship but does not make me weak or a sell out.

    I will be who I am. I will not have to be the same as other women or as men in order to be considered as valuable. It is not an either or. There is that once again, boring middle ground that I call home.

  • Cyndy

    Labels are tricky…feminism is a loaded label.

    While I am grateful for the things that the early women’s liberation movement has afforded me (and I am grateful for it) I see the downside of the more radical elements that are really just a license too….well I’m sure lots of folks reading here can fill in the blank.

    To quote God in Genesis 3:16, “…your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you.” When sin came into this world it messed up the whole order of things including the relationship between men and women.

    God never meant our relationships with each other to be a contest and in Christ it doesn’t have to be. To quote the Apostle Paul”…there are neither male nor female…we are all one in Christ.”

    There is, of course, A LOT to be said here. As a Christian it is most important for me to remember my position in Christ.

  • http://here-everymomentcounts.blogspot.com/ Ambrosia

    I recently wrote a paper regarding feminism. I researched my particular topic extensively, so learned about feminism. One particular point is how feminism has two distinct waves, if you will.
    First, the feminists of the 20′s. I am so grateful for these women securing our right to vote, and to truly be equal to men in the eyes of the law.
    Second, the feminists of the late 50′s and 60′s. This is when the platform changed to a woman’s right to choose. The idea had good intentions, but, as in many good ideas, the intentions were forgotten in the fight. It soon became “wrong” to want to be a stay-at-home mom because that woman was unfulfilled.
    The recent wave of feminism is rather a tangled mess. It has been hijacked by the extremists that make many conservatives and Christians feel uncomfortable.
    However, in recognizing the original feminist movement, I am very grateful for feminism.
    As GrammaMack put it, balance is the important aspect.
    I am a conservative Christian, and very much appreciate how feminism has afforded me the opportunity to attend a wonderful university. I only contend with their proposal that women have a right to choose. It seems the choice is only right when it flows with their philosophy.

  • http://www.elizabethesther.com Elizabeth Esther

    Just wanted to say thank you to everyone for keeping this a civilized discussion. I know that this is a hot-topic and I appreciate the honest, candid feedback. Thanks!

    I agree that labels are tricky things and sometimes inherently unfair.

    In fact, even my use of the label “fundamentalist” might be unfair to those believers who ascribe to fundamentalist tenets without practicing it legalistically.

    The term “feminist” is a loaded label, too. For the sake of easier communication, I used that label–but it certainly doesn’t mean I ascribe to the radical elements of feminism. Because I don’t. :)

    By all standards I am a conservative, traditional woman. And I know that my true freedom is in Jesus Christ.

    However, I am thankful for the work of early feminists–the right to vote, the right to own property, etc.

    I think Rachel (see above) did a great job summarizing my viewpoint. It’s not an either/or proposition.

    Extremism of any persuasion is detrimental to the cause itself.

    The middle ground is boring, perhaps, but it’s safer and reasonable.

    Make sense? Or did I just muddy things up? :)

  • http://humbledyetconfident.wordpress.com Jason

    I certainly could be wrong but it seems to me that feminism is a reaction to the failures of men. Without these failures (and such severe failures at that) there would have been no need for the feminist movement as women would have been treated properly and biblically and allowed their God given freedom.

    Actually, I believe the failures of men are the cause of a great number of injustices in the world… if not all of them.

  • http://www.elizabethesther.com Elizabeth Esther

    Jason: I would say “humbled yet confident” is a perfect description for you and your blog! :) Thanks for chiming in.

    And as my Presbyterian pastor once said: Maybe Adam didn’t do a good job protecting the garden and keeping snakes out in the first place! :)

  • http://mandiesmumblings.blogspot.com mandie

    This is a very refreshing place to sit back and read…I’m enjoying this, and am grateful that you have the ability to articulate what i feel and wish I was better at communicating. :)

  • Michelle Hart

    I agree with Mandie. You do a wonderful job of putting into words so much of what is on my mind. This post speaks to me as do your last few…especially the one about community. You are helping me so much in my own struggle to move on in a relationship with God after leaving the small church I was in for 8 years. (((Thank you for speaking))))

  • http://www.psalm42-2.blogspot.com Stephanie A.

    I’m reading (for the second time) “Radical Womanhood – Feminine Faith in a Feminist World”, by Carolyn Mahaney. I cannot recommend this book enough for Christian women who want a clear, honest understanding of how feminism has affected our culture, the good and the bad.

    After reading this book and evaluating many trends and beliefs that go along with feminism in the past and present, I would think it unwise for any Christian to hold the title of “feminist”. There’s just too much room for misunderstanding. Just my thought.

  • Pat

    once again, you nailed it! Yes, yes, yes.

  • Dee

    Wow, the more I read the Word, for myself, the more I want to take care of my family, stay home, cook/clean, etc. It’s not because someone brainwashed me, it’s just that God created me to love/honor my husband and our children. Modern day feminism mocks this. But, my heart tells me to keep on keeping on…..

  • SaraJ

    I understand what you’re saying about “feminism.” In fundamentalist circles, it’s a hated enemy. Godly women shy away from anything that could be labeled “feminist.”

    The thing is, most of those women never get close to the feminist thought that hates men, devalues children, and lives only for self. No, they’re guarding against “feminist” ideas like contradicting your husband’s opinion or preferring to wear pants instead of skirts. It’s out of the question for a girl to admit that she wants to move out of the home and pursue a life on her own.

    That’s what the fundamentalist mindset fights against: strong women who can stand on their feet with or without a man. That’s what it calls “feminist.” Women aren’t encouraged to cultivate themselves apart from fathers or husbands. (Even though a strong woman can support her husband much better than a clinging vine can.)

    Elizabeth, I think what you and I and others are grateful for is the fact that we are free to find our own strength and identity in God and the world, without having male intermediaries. You don’t find out how to do that in fundamentalist circles; the only people who can tell you how to are “feminists.”

    In that sense, I am very grateful for “feminism.”

    – SJ

  • http://www.sustainablemommy.wordpress.com Naomi

    Great post, Elizabeth!

    As someone who grew up in a strongly anti-feminist community and who has now also experienced a strongly feminist environment, I have to say that neither is perfect, but I’ll choose the feminist option any day. I was working in a Women’s & Gender Studies Department during and after my pregnancy last winter. Not only did they throw me a shower, but were incredibly generous and supportive during the whole process. I could not imagine a more family-friendly environment to work in.

    Certainly there are all kinds of feminists–some make entire careers of duking it out with other feminists over debated issues and definitions within the field. But for all the radical demands of second wave feminism, third wave feminists tend to be more flexible in their views–sometimes to a fault, IMO. These days feminism (in academia, at least) is about far more than just women’s issues, but recognizes the complex ways they are linked to broader community issues. For example, the feminists I know champion paid paternity leave as strongly as paid maternity leave because we know families benefit most from both. Today feminists explore and analyze asymmetrical power relations of all kinds, recognizing that the situation is far more complex than simply men vs. women and that there is no simple formula for justice/equality/equity.

    I especially love your line, “The whole reason fundamentalist women are able to publish books and blogs about “Biblical patriarchy” in the first place is because feminists made it acceptable for women to speak out!” So true.

  • Moara

    Don’t think you can look at secular feminism, see it’s faults, and decry feminism altogether. Secular traditionalism isn’t all that much better.
    To me, feminism is ensuring equal dignity and opportunity for both sexes in society.
    A christian approach to feminism holds to the value of all life, rather than pro-choice, and the value of all women, regardless of their sexual appeal, rather than sexual permissiveness.
    Yes there are lots of problems with secular feminism, but a socially-consious christian will see the abuses of society weighing down on women, and want to change those. I see girls being told their value depends on men finding them attractive, women being hindered in rising in their professions because of choosing to have children, and the playing down of the severity of abuse, and I can’t see myself being anything other than a feminist.

    I see it more as a question of whether feminism needs christians, than whether christians need feminism.

  • Lacinda

    I, personally, love the role of wife and mother, staying home with my children, homeschooling, trying to be a helper and support to my husband . . . I would probably agree a lot more with the “fundamentalists” that you’ve described than with your own views of being a “feminist.” My best friend, however, I’m sure would take your side. We’ve had a lot of interesting conversations on the subject and have found that we actually agree on a lot more than we would have initially thought. I think one of the big things here to beware of (and something that I struggle with!) is a prideful attitude. It’s the temptation to say, “I am this or that, and my way is the best way or the only way.”
    I appreciate Christian women who are vocal and strong and are able to influence society in a Godly way, and I appreciate the very conservative voices that encourage young mothers to invest their lives into their families, dress in a way that doesn’t attract undue attention to themselves, and let their husbands be leaders in the home.
    Thanks for this thought-provoking post. It’s good to see things from another point of view sometimes.

  • maryann

    I just have to add that if you go back far enough,Jesus’teachings were what liberated women,not feminism.

  • Mariana

    Hi,
    I just wanted to share this interesting video from Carolyn McCulley. I’m still thinking about the post. I do agree with being thankful for women rights.. but I wouldn’t consider myself a feminist because of the definition it has in society.

    http://www.vinegarhillpictures.com/video/video_pages/video_pages/radical_woman_hood.html

    much love,
    Mariana

  • http://musingsnstuff.blogspot.com Leanne

    I consider myself to be a feminist in the sense that men and women are created and called by God equally. My husband and I lean strongly towards egalitarianism in our marriage, where we believe that our roles are defined by our strengths and weaknesses, not our gender. If that makes me a feminist, then yes, I am one, and I say it proudly!

    However, I am reluctant to use the actual term “feminist” around people from certain circles, because the word does conjure up ugly images in their minds. Since communication is 90% based on perception and not what I “meant” to say, this is important to keep in mind.

    Someone could come up to me, for example, and say, “I’m gay,” and be using it in its original context [I'm happy!], but my mind would most likely not go there. The words “pimp” and “down with” have also changed meanings over the years.

    So if I am passionate about equality, which I am, and want to discuss this passion with someone else and hopefully convince them of what I feel is the truth, I am going to be careful with the specific words I use in order to not alienate them from the beginning…

    Just my $.02!!!

  • http://adventuresinmercy.wordpress.com molly

    Ah, feminism, the fundamentalist f-word. :)

    I am a Christian feminist. I love what the first-wave feminists did, and I think that, sadly, we need first-wave feminists (of the male and female persuasion) to be more active and vocal in many of our Christian churches…many of which somehow missed the whole part about women getting to have a voice and stuff… (The woman who runs Ladies Against Feminism doesn’t believe that married women should vote…I saw that someone recommended that site and thought I’d throw that in… Jennie Chancey seems like a *very* nice woman, but the extremist position she takes on many issues is not something I’d recommend to anyone).

    If I am admitting to being a feminist, I am usually careful to say “Christian feminist” because that helps qualify what I mean: I mean that men and woman are created as equal image bearers and should be treated and afforded with the same rights and opportunities.

    Most feminists are NOT of the radical left variety, just as more Christians are not of the radical right variety. I think that those who say we shouldn’t use the word “feminist” also shouldn’t use the word, “Christian,” because it’s certainly associated with a lot of horrid things too, and often rightly so, thanks to the fact that the loudest and most insane voices are usually those who get noticed. The rest of us, quietly going about our business, are assumed to be just like the loud weird ones…and we will continue to be so, unless we prove that the label isn’t owned by the loud wacko’s, but by perfectly normal people who look for ways to do good in their communities…

    I think we should take the word feminist back (just as we should take the word Christian back). It needs to stop being the f-word and start being just a normal natural part of following Christ.

    Loving some of these comments above, btw… Great stuff!

    Your Christian Feminist Friend,
    Molly :)

  • Nicole

    Most times I’ll say I’m an equalist.
    Saying I’m a feminist (initially) can give off a lot of reactions based off of their experiences. If they ask what an “equalist” is, I’ll say that I am a first wave feminist (1800′s) and that Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Susan B. Anthony are my homegirls.

    I’m a fairly conservative Christian and my parents are very conservative. Yet, my dad freely admits that feminism did some very good things. The stories he tell happened at least 20 years ago, and he still tells him with the same pride every time.

    1.- A female Relative (call her Ann), went shopping at a JC Penney when she decided to open an account there. Ann and her husband were not rich, but they got by through pouring themselves into their co-owned farm. The cashier would not let Ann open the account without her husband present and signing for her. Needless to say, she was furious, went to the manager, and well, that store has sinced changed its policy. :)

    2.- My aunt (dad’s sister) and my dad were looking to buy a house for my grandma. Now, my aunt had not gone to college, but had been working since she was 15 to help support the family. She had 15 years in the workforce and a well paying job. When she went to get the loan, they would not accept her because she was a “high-risk” client. “High-risk” meant she was a woman and likely to get married. My dad had to come sign for her. The ridiculous thing is that my dad was fresh out of college with several thousand in debt and no job!

    This was the 80′s!

    I would like nothing more that to be a SAHM to my 14 children while wearing my long skirts. :)
    I am soo grateful that this is something I might be able to do.

    I am currently a college student studying to be a nurse at a Christian college. I am so grateful to be able to do that as well.

    Radical feminism has damaged a lot of people. So has radical patriarchy.

    Personally, I am glad that my husband can no longer legally beat me. I am glad that I am not a second-class citizen.

    Funny fact- did you know that feminism really got started with the abolitionist movement? The women were excellent speakers and were such a vital part of the Underground Railroad, that people thought maybe women weren’t stupid after all!

    I mean, it’s hard to argue that women are incapable of coherent thought when you have Harriet Tubman, Sojourner Truth, Harriet Beecher Stowe, Lucretia Mott and Elizabeth Cady Stanton all stirring up the country!

  • http://thatmarriedcouple.blogspot.com/ Elizabeth

    I think we’re all in agreement that there are several types of feminists, that most people are grateful for the First Wave, and that we don’t think selfishness in the name of feminism is acceptable.

    I know I’m a little late to this discussion, but I thought I’d throw a few resources out there.

    Feminists for Life is just what it says:
    http://www.feministsforlife.org/

    New Feminism is being led by Catholic women, but I think it’s a really universal understanding that all Christian women can embrace.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_feminism
    http://www.thenewfeminism.net/thenewfeminism/Articles.html

    And there are tons of other books and articles out there on this topic! Thanks for hosting this topic, Elizabeth, and thanks to everyone for keeping it so civil!

  • http://dougdraws.com Doug C.

    A woman should be who God made her to be. Simple as that.

  • http://quiveringdaughters.blogspot.com/ Quivering Daughters

    Truly full of insight and grace. You were right ~ the comments here are fantastic!

  • http://donorcycle.blogspot.com Susan

    I’m so glad you took on this topic. I do think feminism has mellowed a lot from the man-hating years. It is a charged word and so hard to pin down exactly what it means because people already have an opinion formed. I think Nicole’s comments above really nail it. (And good luck with nursing school!)